Abe Dubin, aka Orange Man, is one of the brainiest brain geniuses on Fancy Lad, everyone’s favorite bizarro, Boston-born indie skate company. He got in touch recently to see if we’d be down to do an exclusive release of his latest opus, “Mad Maestro.” Obviously we were into it, but that conversation sparked another conversation about maybe having a conversation further down the line. An interview, if you will. This is that interview. This is also our opportunity to announce that Orange Man, who is clearly an expert at having fun on a skateboard (or several skateboards bolted together with hinges), is going to be writing a semi-regular column on the subject for us, titled “The Joy of Skateboarding.” Stay tuned for his debut tomorrow, which I can say with a straight face is the most absurd and uplifting 300 words I’ve ever read on skateboarding!
Interview by Tobias Coughlin-Bogue
Photos by Jason Magid
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Have you always been the guy with the weird boards?
If you go way back in time, to the very first two iterations of the Fancy Lad videos, I’m more into just being powerslide guy, or having multiple boards.
When did you start freaking boards?
I think it was right around the time when A Golden Egg came out. That was with Jesse James, as well as Chris Atherton, they’re guys from the UK. They did an entire full-length, I guess 13 minutes or so, where every single clip is a bizarre, invented board. After I saw that video, I was like, “This is something I can do!” It’s all shot with a tripod, so basically anywhere you are, all you need is some free time to build your strange board. You choose a composition and you can just work on it for hours and hours, you don’t need anyone else there.
I like that you say composition, because in the latest video you put out for us, The Mad Maestro, every shot seems really carefully considered. Also, the whole music thing!
Thank you, I literally meant like in film or painting. That’s really what I got out of that A Golden Egg video. Jesse James talks a little bit about that, where each shot is still or stationary. So the skater comes in and out of frame. He talks about how it’s almost like a painting. I think of it as like a living painting.
Before the weird skateboarding, when did you start skateboarding, originally?
I got my first little flexible, see-through, lime green deck at the used board store when I was like 7. I’d tic-tac around the neighborhood and stuff like that.
Did you do all the normal tricks? Like learning to ollie and all that?
At that age I didn’t even know that tricks existed. I didn’t know that ollies existed. So me and my friends would just see how many times we could spin around on it doing tic-tacs.
Getting dizzy!
Yeah exactly, or do the kind of tic-tacs where you’re just walking around using the board. And, like, the X-games, we had just kind of become aware of that. This was pre-Tony Hawk’s 900, and this was also pre-Tony Hawk video game.
So you had no external videos giving you clues on how you were “supposed to” skate, basically?
Right, and our influences in skating were, like, the Ninja Turtles and Bart Simpson. We didn’t know that you could even do anything! So there was no pressure, it literally was a toy.
Is that how you’ve always skated then?
Well, no. I had it as a just a toy and it’s a pure, fun thing. I had other hobbies, then I kind of revisited it at age 14. All the other neighborhood kids, they got their special Christmas completes from CCS, and they’re learning how to ollie and kickflip, and I’m like, “Oh, well I already know how to ride, I’ll join you guys again. I’ll get a real board.” Then I quickly realized that skating, when you’re trying to skate, is a lot of doing nothing, for hours on end.
[Laughing] You’re talking to somebody who just spent an hour trying to do a kickflip back tail, which is a trick I learned fifteen years ago!
Did you get it?
I did, but…it’s fun in its own way, but a different kind of fun. It’s more like frustration and achievement than joy.
Exactly. It’s funny too, because at the time I was into American Kenpo. That’s like a martial art, like karate. So I was transitioning out of that and into skateboarding, and I realized that, like, they’re both not that fun. [Laughing] But it’s something that you work at for hours for a feeling of accomplishment.
People really idolize that in skateboarding. But then there’s people who are on the other side of things. Who are just, like, trying to have a good laugh.
It’s a fine line, because I feel like you kind of have to have at least a remedial skill set of riding to even have fun. Sometimes it’s important to plug away at learning the bare bones, so that you can apply them and have fun. As corny as it sounds, sometimes you’ve got to practice, so that when the right obstacle comes along, you can have the time of your life on it.
True. I guess it’s key to know a few slide tricks so you can at least boardslide something.
Exactly. But I did fall in love with the joy of learning. Where, like, to ollie over a little 2 x 4 was the great joy of my life. It took a month of practicing the timing of snapping my tail, but then when I finally did it I was like, I can do anything! And then when I dropped in on my first 4-foot quarterpipe, I was like, I never thought I’d be able to do that, what else is there?
You just want to keep going!
It’s so intoxicating when you’re unlocking all of these things that you never thought you’d be able to do.
Yeah! I pretty much kept at it into my 30s because there’s so much left to learn. But I watch your videos and I’m kind of jealous of you just going out and fucking around with a crazy board. Like, you’re not trying to land anything—you do land a lot of things that are extremely improbable, like How did you get the board to come back together and then ride away on it? But a lot of it is just like, How weird can we get?
Honestly, there usually is one hopeful, predestined thing that will happen. But the chances of that actually happening are very slim. Occasionally it does happen, but then the learning process is going to be entertaining on its own!
So this brings us to the central question here: Is it skateboarding?
[Laughs] Well I’d say so.
You’re on a skateboard, right?
That’s the thing. I think if it has trucks—that’s kind of been my bottom line, that it has trucks. But I have stretched it a little further than that, because I think that if you’re a skater and that’s your main preoccupation in life, that anything that you do is skating. Skating is an expression of your attitudes and your abilities and your opinions, so why wouldn’t everything else you do be like that?
Yeah, I’m actually really ready to agree with that. Your personal style is really represented in the way you skate. I like to think I write the way I skate. I don’t know what you do for a living, but I hope you do it the way you skate!
Well I ride my bike around and I tune up these rental bikes. I work for a bike share here in Washington D.C.
Oh, so your handiness and your ability to make Frankenstein boards really helps out?
Yeah. So basically I’m cruising around using tools, so it has a lot to do with my skating.
I’m curious, how did you come to be the Orange Man? Why specifically Orange?
Oh man…I’m gonna have to pass.
The secret goes to the grave with you?
I have to leave some mystery for the fans.
Well that’s all of my rote, formulaic questions. Now that we’ve had a good philosophical discussion of skateboarding, what is your favorite thing about skateboarding? Actually,shit, that’s a philosophical question, but oh well.
Y’know, it changes all the time, but I think it’s always going to be skating something brand new, whether it’s a brand new board I’ve upgraded, or even a brand new normal board. Or hopefully a brand new spot, that’s untouched by me or anyone else. Something so fresh, that feels fresh on the feet!
What’s your least favorite thing about skateboarding?
Well, the opposite of that: Going to the same old curb, going to the same old skatepark that I’ve been to a million times. Watching the same people do their same runs.
Yeah, it can really get repetitive at the skatepark. So, uh, you also do a lot of creative stuff other than skating—and you’re about to do some of that for us—what do you want to tell people? What do you want the skaters who read your column to understand?
I just think that thinking about skating, or overthinking about skating—as people often tell me that I do—is something that should be valued and encouraged. And I think skaters, if nothing else, are extremely thoughtful. But we’re kind of forced into a box where we’re meant to pretend that we’re dumb and tough and thoughtless.
Wow, that’s the best answer you could have given. I don’t know what else you need to say.
Thank you. I struggle with that one a lot, because sometimes I feel like I need to dumb myself down. And then I’m like, Well people think what I’m doing is already dumb. It’s a paradox that I’m in, as far as reaching my audience!
Yeah, you’re on some meta shit. You’re doing stuff that people think is dumb, but it’s actually making them thinking about skateboarding. Making them ask that question, Is it skateboarding? And then, What is skateboarding? So actually it’s pretty smart, and maybe people just don’t get it.
Right, but if I say, Well you don’t get it, then I’m the pretentious asshole.
We’re all pretentious assholes in skateboarding.
That’s something we can all agree on.
Ha! Any last words?
Um, just shout out to the Fancy Lads, the greatest company in skateboarding! Buy my new pro model, it might be out by the time this is out.
Follow Abe on Instagram: @abedubin.
